LIVE BLOG: City Council Meeting for March 21, 2016

Published on by Adam A. Donaldson

Two major pieces of rezoning are up for discussion at this week’s city council meeting. You can click here for the amended agenda from City Hall, and you can click here to read Politico’s preview of tonight’s meeting. For the complete blow-by-blow of tonight’s council meeting, you can follow me on Twitter, or follow along below via Storify.

by
Adam A. Donaldson
Sat, Sep 23 2017 18:35:55

Guelph City Council Meeting – March 21, 2016

Live blog from the meeting starting at 7 pm.

  1. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    From Guelph Politico: Preview of tonight’s council meeting.  http://guelphpolitico.blogspot.ca/2016/03/city-council-preview-whats-on-agenda_17.html …

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 15:27:21

  2. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    From Guelph Politico: One Guelphite’s fight to get the Victoria Rd Rec Centre’s weight room back.  http://guelphpolitico.blogspot.ca/2016/03/community-concerned-about-loss-of.html …

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 15:29:17

  3. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Follow the action from tonight’s #Guelph city council meeting on the Politico live blog.  http://guelphpolitico.blogspot.ca/2016/03/live-blog-city-council-meeting-for_21.html …

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 15:34:21

  4. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    It’s the final countdown to tonight’s #Guelph city council meeting. Follow the live blog here:  http://guelphpolitico.blogspot.ca/2016/03/live-blog-city-council-meeting-for_21.html …

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 22:46:46

  5. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Mayor @CamGuthrie says council’s going to take a 5 minute break between closed meet and open one.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:02:40

  6. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Update on closed session:
    Guelph Storm: Staff given direction
    CAO contract: Direction given to subcommittee.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:07:45

  7. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    In leading “O Canada: tonight, @thatjamesgordon went with “all thy sons command” rather than “all our sons command.” Interesting.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:10:26

  8. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    First up, honour Gryphon football team for Yates Cup win.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:10:46

  9. Here the Yates Cup sits before #Guelph city council. https://t.co/Rdm59Embyj

    Here the Yates Cup sits before #Guelph city council. pic.twitter.com/Rdm59Embyj
    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    ·

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:12:34

  10. The official shot. https://t.co/njysTGL7Y8

    The official shot. pic.twitter.com/njysTGL7Y8
    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    ·

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:14:15

  11. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    City clerk Stephen O’Brien used to play for the Gryphons, continues to coach part time. #factoid

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:14:40

  12. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Cllr @PhilAlltWard3 moving the minutes now.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:15:18

  13. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Minutes passed 13-0

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:15:56

  14. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Corporate Services Committee, Outstanding Motions of the Corporate Services Committee consent report will be voted on first.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:16:41

  15. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    A second matter on Tax Ratio will be “extracted.”

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:16:55

  16. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Consent report passes 13-0

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:17:23

  17. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Governance Committee, Governance Options Regarding the County of Wellington’s Social Services Committee also received as consent report 13-0

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:18:06

  18. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Next, Public Services Committee reports.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:20:32

  19. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    All Public Services Committee to be received as consent reports. Passes 13-0

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:21:25

  20. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Delegations for OMB Jurisdiction, and Vic Rd. Rec Centre renos.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:22:24

  21. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Susan Radliffe up first to speak to the Petrie Building.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:22:46

  22. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    She says she’s a proud Guelphite and this places matters. Wants council to approve Reserve Grant Application.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:23:14

  23. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Radcliffe says the Petrie is “A faded beauty standing green and winked on Wyndham St.”

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:23:43

  24. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Radcliffe says arts & culture tourists spend more/stay longer than “average tourist”.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:24:32

  25. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Restored Petrie building will be a major attraction for tourists, Radcliffe says.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:25:22

  26. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Crowd funding and traditional fundraising to play a part in raising funds to restore Petrie.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:26:05

  27. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Cllr Bell asks Radcliffe to describe how the restored building will look. Not clear to the general public.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:26:48

  28. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    The windows and frames will be repaired, it will start to look like a building with potential.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:27:42

  29. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    The facade being held on with screws, water flowing between the building and facade has rusted them.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:28:08

  30. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Key piece may be “sitting in someone’s basement.” Radcliffe says it was “taken on a drunk spree.”

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:28:43

  31. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    The price of a pineapple? $5,000

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:29:10

  32. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Cllr. Salisbury asks about the community opportunity in crowd funding.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:30:31

  33. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Bell originated the term: “Local icon, national treasure.” The Petrie is one of Canada’s 10 endangered buildings.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:31:06

  34. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Radcliffe says there’s been interest across the country in the Petrie. Refers to website “This Place Matters”

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:31:36

  35. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Perhaps ppl from all across Canada are interested in “buying a piece of the Petrie.”

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:32:08

  36. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    ACO will be offering tax refundable receipts to buy that piece.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:32:30

  37. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    The motion will see that taxes are not raised on the renovated Petrie for 10 years.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:33:13

  38. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Cllr MacKinnon wants to assure that city isn’t left holding the bag if the reassessed value doesn’t add up to $91K over 10 yrs.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:34:17

  39. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Not written in stone, says staff.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:34:29

  40. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Motion passes 13-0.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:34:37

  41. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Next up, @CathyDowner‘s discussion about OMB jurisdiction. 3 delegates up to talk about it.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:35:51

  42. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Former Ward 1 candidate Maria Pezzano speaking in favour of Downer’s motion.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:37:00

  43. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Need to be free to think about what’s best for Guelph, not the deveopler.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:37:19

  44. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Michele Richardson of McElderry Residents Community Inc. speaking next.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:38:02

  45. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Richardson wants council to adopt Downer’s motion. Developers use OMB as “part of a game” she says. Goes over the head of elected officials

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:39:10

  46. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Spelling correction. That’s Susan Ratcliffe. Apologies.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:40:05

  47. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Few groups can martial the resources to take on the OMB, an unfair playing field between developers and community groups.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:40:45

  48. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Councillors lose the ability to determine growth in own city, says Richardson.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:41:21

  49. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    No incentive for developers to be reasonable since they can go to OMB, says Richardson.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:41:50

  50. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Richardson’s fourth point, need to think about the future.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:42:36

  51. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Ignoring OMB reform is at our peril, it must be addressed.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:42:58

  52. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    No questions from council for Richardson

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:43:26

  53. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Bruce Ryan, Prez of Old Univ. Neighbourhood Assoc. now speaking in support.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:43:56

  54. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Association has found decisions of council has been fair, however…

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:45:10

  55. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    The OMB is quasi-judicial. “Arcane legal practices” take president of local circumstances/knowledge.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:45:56

  56. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Case #1: person wanted full 2nd floor to garage, took it to the OMB and won overruling comm of adjustment.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:46:50

  57. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Case #2: Assoc. had an expert, the applicant didn’t. Expert opinion wins.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:47:28

  58. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Ryan: Unwanted develop and land uses forced on city and against “long term local interest” at the OMB

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:48:12

  59. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Downer will now explain her motion.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:48:51

  60. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    The root of Downer’s motion that the agenda refers to:  http://www.newspapers-online.com/auroran/?p=13283 …

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:49:42

  61. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Downer working with other GTA councillors at a summit on May 14 about OMB reform.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:50:16

  62. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    The review the province is doing on development is coming up later this year. Downer worries there will just be some “tinkering”

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:51:10

  63. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    “We need real reform on this matter,” says Downer.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:51:25

  64. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Downer: None of that is to say we don’t need oversight. Ontario is only province with this kind of oversight.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:52:57

  65. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    “We need to put them on notice that we need significant reform.” Downer says of OMB

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:54:46

  66. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Cllr Allt believes the legacy of this council is to see OMB reformed or abolished.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:56:00

  67. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Allt says OMB has authority in 30 different acts. More than Mins of Health and Education, 2 biggest spenders in ON gov.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:57:02

  68. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Cllr Hofland says she resonated with neighbourhood groups presenting tonight b/c of her experience.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:58:29

  69. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Mayor Guthrie says he remembers the Howitt Park NG garage sale. “I got some good deals,” he says.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:59:16

  70. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Deputy CAO sees no concerns with Downer’s motion.

    Mon, Mar 21 2016 23:59:37

  71. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Cllr Piper says it makes no sense that the province gives power with one hand, takes it away with other.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:00:17

  72. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Cllr. Gibson says this isn’t an attack on developers. Speaking about true outliers and bypassing the process. He supports that reform.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:00:57

  73. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Gibson wants to attach Patrick Brown and Andrea Horwath to the motion.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:02:45

  74. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Motion passes 13-0

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:02:51

  75. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Guthrie asks council to cc LUMCO (Large Urban Mayors Caucus of Ontario) too. Allt moves, Piper seconds.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:03:59

  76. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    “We do well here in Guelph usually,” says Downer. “It’s about the process we’re dragged into.”

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:07:34

  77. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Impact on budget, planning, engineering… A lot of city resources zapped, says Downer.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:07:53

  78. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Vote on the main motion as amended. 13-0

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:08:31

  79. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Guthrie notes the message is being sent unanimously.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:08:48

  80. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Next Victoria Rd. Recreation renos. Peter Guth of Guelph Minor Hockey to speak first.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:09:17

  81. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Guth praises city for engaging with user groups.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:09:55

  82. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Guelph needs rinks, Guth says. Taking one off line for a year affects 1500 players.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:10:52

  83. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    According to construction plan though, the rink will reopen in September.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:11:21

  84. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Unless that’s changed since December.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:11:41

  85. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Registration fees largest revenue generation for Guelph Minor Hockey. 972 hotel rooms rented tournament weekend.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:12:56

  86. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    I happen to know from my own knowledge of Guelph hotels, that’s more than 3/4 of all hotel rooms in the city.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:13:24

  87. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Guth wants to find a way to keep the rink open. No Q from council.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:14:02

  88. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Ken Mark to speak for John Gerrard of Guelph Marlins Aquatic Club.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:14:22

  89. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    GMAC has 900 members across various programs.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:14:46

  90. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    2 Olympic swimmers, 9 members of the national team too.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:15:08

  91. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    1000s of swimmers come in every year for tournaments. GMAC enthusiastic about more with renos.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:15:52

  92. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    1700 parents happy that there will be no impact on GMAC programs schedule.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:16:18

  93. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    No Qs for Ken Mark. Cynthia Fobert up next. This is what she has to say:  http://guelphpolitico.blogspot.ca/2016/03/community-concerned-about-loss-of.html …

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:16:59

  94. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Fobert looking to get the fitness room and sauna back into the plan.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:17:47

  95. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    The current reno plan sees VRRC lose the fitness room and sauna for bigger change rooms, gender neutral washroom, family change room

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:18:31

  96. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    “My 86 year old mother is not going to get into spandex and go to GoodLife fitness,” Fobert said.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:19:30

  97. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Asking council to bring back fitness room, and promote it as a place for seniors to work out.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:20:34

  98. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    No Qs from council

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:20:50

  99. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Guthrie turns it back over to council. MacKinnon asks what has council learned in this process to avoid costs overruns.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:21:34

  100. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Timely infrastructure repairs is the less, says staff. Age and backlog are the reasons for the price tag.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:22:09

  101. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Van Hellemond asking about the plan for weight room and sauna room space.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:22:38

  102. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    The design limits foot print. Change rooms and washrooms have to be ODEA specific, hence weight room and sauna had to go.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:23:26

  103. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    There maybe pieces of fitness equipment throughout the facility, but they won’t be in one place.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:24:01

  104. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Also, trying to keep costs low.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:24:10

  105. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Bell says its regretful that things are dropped, but wonders where the extra money is coming from in the reserves.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:24:56

  106. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    There should be time to build the preserve back in the next couple of years, says staff.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:25:40

  107. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Piper ask if city’s looked at programming outdoor equipment.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:26:24

  108. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Staff: Absolutely. It could be a phase 2 measure, again trying to keep project budget reasonable. Will be brought back

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:27:05

  109. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Gibson asking about existing equipment. Are they at end of life? Status?

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:27:51

  110. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Equipment close to end of life, but it will be repurposed. New community space will be programmed with active fitness. Small weights avail

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:28:33

  111. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Gibson implores council to let this go forward. Everyone, at some point, intersects with their community centre.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:29:51

  112. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Bell says it’s nice to see this off paper.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:30:27

  113. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Guthrie likes the praise for staff. Thanks them for due diligence and avoid crisis moment on cost overrun.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:31:26

  114. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    VRRC report passes 13-0

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:31:35

  115. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Going back to Tax Ratio report.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:31:56

  116. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    “The general observation is that Guelph is sitting in the midrange with its commercial, industrial and multi-residential class tax ratios.”

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:32:37

  117. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    “The general observation is that Guelph is sitting in the midrange with its commercial, industrial and multi-residential class tax ratios.”

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:32:37

  118. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Council needs to make a decision tonight so that tax invoices can be readied.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:33:59

  119. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Billings says she won’t be supporting. We’re in the range, not the highest, not the lowest.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:34:51

  120. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Gibson says we’re in the middle, but the ratio not inline with the province.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:35:42

  121. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    We need to work on ratios, but concerned about industrial ratio. Will see investment cycle from U.S. pick up.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:36:01

  122. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Gibson talked about that on last week’s @OS_Guelph –  http://opensourcesguelph.com/2016/03/17/open-sources-show-notes-for-thursday-march-17-2016/ …

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:36:33

  123. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Gibson wants to see a way to pass the ratio adjustment for industrial, but not residential.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:37:06

  124. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Staff: By law letters have to be sent out to tenants and landlords in the event of substantive decrease. Must pass on savings.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:38:36

  125. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Bell: it should be evident the way we’re taxing at the moment is not very fair. Trying to make policy fairer year after year.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:39:46

  126. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Taxpayers hope that council reacts to taxation based on fairness, Bell will support.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:40:39

  127. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    “It’s not a perfect system […] but it’s more our job to be fare than to cater to our electors.” Bell.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:41:33

  128. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Allt adds that Chamber has been asking for fairness.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:41:59

  129. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    The shift equalizes, says Hofland. We’re in the last year of 4-year phase in, council concerns can be addressed next year.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:42:44

  130. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    MacKInnon looking for info about why the policy comes after the budget process, not before.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:43:29

  131. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Staff: can provide “guestimates” but final numbers don’t become available until mid-December.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:44:12

  132. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    MacKinnon: trying to understand why we need to wait for impact.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:45:56

  133. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Staff: if all classes increased at same rate, no problem. But diff. increases have shits and that translates into diff. analysis.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:46:33

  134. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Wettstein says fairness used to be an ability to pay formula. Commercial/Industrial paid more.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:48:50

  135. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Single-family homes hit hardest as trying to define fairness. Wettstein doesn’t have answer though.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:49:13

  136. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Wettstein: “If you reduce one, you have to raise the other. We don’t know who will get hit in the head this year.”

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:49:54

  137. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Gibson asks if Guelph is to move to provincial guidelines and ratios, how would that affect us on the spectrum?

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:51:08

  138. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Guthrie says we’ll see that as a takeaway tonight. Need time to come up with answer to Gibson Q

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:52:00

  139. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Billings: Who wants to do what the province tells you to do?

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:52:16

  140. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Guthrie asks if there’s been any discussion of moving budget process to Feb/March.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:52:48

  141. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Wasn’t brought up in committee, but there are pros and cons, and costs of doing budgets later.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:53:11

  142. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    City can get tenders out early and get better pricing by passing budget in December.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:53:42

  143. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Creates uncertainty in moving forward with initiatives approving budget later in the year.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:54:18

  144. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Also, more municipalities moving to December budgeting.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:54:36

  145. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Budget briefing will be happening in May.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:54:57

  146. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Vote passes 7-6. Guthrie, Billings, Van Hellemond, Gibson, MacKinnon against.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:55:59

  147. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    5 minute recess.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 00:56:06

  148. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Council meeting going again. The topic: Stormwater funding.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:05:52

  149. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Bell wants to move to a user-fee system as per the report. Good policy, and eliminates trading off stormwater for other things.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:06:36

  150. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Bell: haven’t seen discuss about how to mitigate the imposition of the fee on regular taxation.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:08:47

  151. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Bell: doesn’t want this to be a new tax, or new fee, wants it to be revenue neutral, or as close to is as it can be.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:09:45

  152. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Need to give staff direction as to how this will affect general tax concerns.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:10:03

  153. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Will need to be referred to Corporate Services Committee for further consideration.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:10:40

  154. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    The main motion was forwarded and second, plus Bell’s amendment.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:11:15

  155. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Allt is not certain the amendment is in order. Sending something an element to committee.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:12:37

  156. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Guthrie says it’s in order.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:12:48

  157. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Billings says it’s about not double dipping.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:13:28

  158. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    $716K in operating budget for stormwater. #3.8M for capital.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:14:17

  159. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Over 2% impact on budget, or $4.5M

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:14:41

  160. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Gibson says if $4.5M is to be taken off the tax rolls, then the discussion should happen at corporate services not the full council

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:16:28

  161. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Hofland wants to hear staff’s opinion on amendment.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:17:42

  162. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Staff has no problem with having that convo at Corporate Services. Money from operating budget for stormwater comes from couple of sources

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:18:34

  163. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Billings says he do need the conversation so that council is all on the same page financially.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:19:34

  164. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Vote on amendment passes 13-0

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:19:47

  165. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Billings begins discussion on main motion, multi-res and industrial seem to be getting hit hard.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:21:50

  166. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Current system, single res carrying more of the burden than multi-res and industrial.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:22:25

  167. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    At this point in time, there was an estimate based on other municipalities for 5% admin costs for setting up system.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:23:49

  168. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Consultant: assumption that 8% of revenue will be given away as credits.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:25:23

  169. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Billings trying to get out of consultant if residential rates will go up if a significant amount of credits are given out.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:29:16

  170. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Consultant holds to his formula and research.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:29:58

  171. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    There will be a significant community engagement process with implementation of credit program. That’s the next phase.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:30:47

  172. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    MacKinnon thinks we need to make a move on stormwater infrastructure, but thinks conclusions in this report are erroneous.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:31:33

  173. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    MacKinnon: big problem is 2 different types of fairness. Imbalance btwn res and industrial, creates unfairness btwn residential.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:32:44

  174. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    3000 sq ft detached home different footprint than townhouse, for example.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:33:19

  175. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    MacKinnon: we’re now saying that semis, town and condos are going to fund detached.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:35:22

  176. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Guthrie to MacKinnon: “I’m just wanting to know if you’re going to comment forever.”

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:36:02

  177. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    We have to be addressing backlog, MacKinnon adds.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:37:31

  178. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Scott Stewart: there are 10 options in report, the balancing act has been included in those options.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:39:13

  179. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Guthrie asking if MacKinnon would like to see staff explore specific options offered.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:41:56

  180. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    An amendment to refer the matter back to Corporate Services.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:42:34

  181. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Amendment to refer concerns back to committee to see more expansive report from the option, MacKinnon.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:45:37

  182. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    MacKinnon motion to refer matter back to IDE for more considerations. Wettstein seconds.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:46:05

  183. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Salisbury: staff has spent 2 years working on this, a thorough investigation. Have they not done all the work?

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:46:58

  184. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    “It’s almost a rhetorical question,” says Salisbury.
    “That’s a difficult question to answer,” suggests Guthrie.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:47:31

  185. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Stewart says “If this is referred back to IDE I would be scratching my head.” Not sure what else council thinks they can do.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:48:26

  186. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Salisbury says it’s not often his landscape architecture background comes into play on council. This is one of those times it does.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:49:21

  187. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Salisbury says he lives in townhouse complex, almost 100% runs into stormwater.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:50:19

  188. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Salisbury says he lives in townhouse complex, almost 100% runs into stormwater.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:50:19

  189. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    A much larger home will have larger absorption, says Salisbury. Will refer to staff’s expert analysis.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:50:55

  190. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Implantation methods will come back to council for a vote anyway.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:51:42

  191. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Bell thinks this is a significant move in the area of fairness. e will never get it perfect but continue to try.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:53:25

  192. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Vote on MacKinnon’s referral. Fails 3-10. Bell, Billings and MacKinnon vote in favour.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:54:22

  193. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Gibson has concerns from citizens. $200k-$300K for administration, which is correct.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:56:11

  194. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Gibson: are we going to see efficiencies “on the other side.”
    Staff: the predictable funs will allow better alignment of programs.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:57:24

  195. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Gibson: Are we going to see credits offered to industrial clients?

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:58:14

  196. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Options exist for property owners in report.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 01:58:58

  197. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Gibson to read from letter about citizen concern about double dipping.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 02:00:23

  198. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Gibson wants to assure ppl of Guelph that this is kept off their tax bill.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 02:01:34

  199. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Guthrie wants to call vote on main amendment, seeing if MacKinnon wants to add amendment.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 02:02:00

  200. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    MacKinnon: there’s an appetite for a decision tonight.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 02:02:18

  201. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Guthrie says that he’d like more info on option #4, been kind of subtly trying to get MacKinnon to move that way.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 02:03:56

  202. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    MacKinnon says the vote closes the book, and choses the direction without further discussion.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 02:05:57

  203. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Vote passes 11-2. MacKinnon and Billings vote against. That’s for the main motion.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 02:06:35

  204. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Motion to approve by-law to authorize agreement between Melloul-Blamey for VRRC. Passes 13-0

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 02:07:39

  205. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Allt says next month is Organ Donor Awareness Month. Flag raising on april 8.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 02:08:05

  206. adamadonaldson

    Adam A. Donaldson@adamadonaldson
    Meeting adjourned.

    Tue, Mar 22 2016 02:08:13

 

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